Lisa Lewis 00:00:00 Sensitive in nature is part of the practice of the Practice Network, a network of podcasts seeking to help you market and grow your business and yourself. To hear other podcasts like the Impact Driven Leader podcast and Behind the Bite podcast, go to practice of the practice. Com forward slash network. Welcome to Sensitive in Nature. The podcast invites you to explore the profound connection between highly sensitive people and the natural world. I’m your host, Lisa Lewis, and I’m thrilled to embark on this journey with you. In each episode will delve into the unique experiences, challenges, and gifts of being highly sensitive while discovering how nature serves as a sanctuary for those who feel deeply, we’ll hear stories from individuals who have found solace, strength and inspiration in the embrace of the natural world. So if you’re someone who feels a deep kinship with nature, or if you’re curious about the transformative power it holds for highly sensitive people, you’re in the right place. Let’s embark on this journey together, and may it lead us to a deeper understanding of ourselves and the world around us. Lisa Lewis 00:01:35 Welcome to the Sensitive and Nature podcast, where we explore the profound connection between sensitivity, nature and personal growth. Today, we’re diving into the journey of navigating a spiritual awakening as a highly sensitive person. Joining me is Katie Turner, a registered psychologist, speaker, and the founder of Katie Turner psychology. She is also the author of F Toxic Spirituality. Avoiding red flags and navigating the spiritual path with integrity. Katie’s holistic approach combines Western psychology with eastern healing practices to help her clients heal the past, find peace in the present, and create their best possible future. Katie’s mission to integrate the science of psychology with the practice of spirituality has inspired modern day spiritual seekers worldwide. When she’s not guiding clients or developing new resources, you can find her exploring the Rocky Mountains or practicing yoga in her home of Calgary, Alberta, Canada. So let’s explore Katie’s wisdom on this fascinating and deeply personal topic. Welcome to the show, Katie. Katie Turner 00:02:51 Thank you so much for having me. Lisa Lewis 00:02:53 It’s so great to have you here. And I, I love this topic that we’re going to be talking about, especially for highly sensitive persons on spiritual awakening. Lisa Lewis 00:03:06 And before we dive into that, do you consider yourself an HSP? Yeah, I realized. Katie Turner 00:03:14 I hadn’t heard about Highly Sensitive until I was already a few years into the field of psychology, had done all my graduate training and everything. So it was after that that I found out about the term and saw the self-test and found Doctor Erin’s work. And yes, definitely consider myself highly sensitive. I’ve done her training to be an approved therapist provider for highly sensitive clients as well. I’m also empathic or an empath as well, so I do specialize in working with people who are both. Lisa Lewis 00:03:46 Well that’s wonderful. And as I’ve talked to other therapist psychologists on the show, it seems like everyone’s been guided by Doctor Elaine Aron’s work and her books, and then resonating with it. And then I’m kind of going on their own path with that new information that they found about themselves and how they, you know, how they work with clients and begin to work with clients in a different way. So I’m wondering what is exactly a spiritual awakening? Katie Turner 00:04:20 Yeah. Katie Turner 00:04:20 So I’d really describe it more of an it could be an experience. It might be a profound experience or series of experiences where it’s really more it changes your sense of reality. It’s a sense of connection with something greater than yourself. And it’s beyond just the rational mind. It’s not so much a thought exercise of is there something more? Is there something bigger beyond us? It but it’s more of an actual shift and experiential shift of really a felt sense of connection with it, whether it’s like Source God, universal energy, there’s lots of different terms or language. but I think a lot of it is capturing that same essence of where we are part of this more quantum field and a very experiential reality of that kind of loving, all powerful source beyond just our individual mind. Lisa Lewis 00:05:13 Yes, I love that. And do you have to go through, like a bad experience to have a spiritual awakening? I know. it’s just from my personal experience and this talking to other people, that that’s very common for that to happen. Lisa Lewis 00:05:30 But I’m wondering from your experience and what, you know, do you have to have a bad experience to have a spiritual awakening? Katie Turner 00:05:37 No, I mean, it’s very different for every person. anything that any experience that kind of humans can have, there’s usually multiple pathways to get there. And the research around spiritual awakenings, what’s out there so far is that there are there are different paths. For some people it can be about event or a traumatic type. Awakening for others is more slow, gradual. it feels very supportive. People often talk about kind of the dark night of the soul. So I think there is a bit of reorganising with it, but the process is going to feel very different for everyone, and that’s part of kind of why I even wrote my book was there’s a lot of kind of assumptions or misinformation out there when it’s spiritual awakenings, and intuition is something that not many professionals talk about very openly, even even if it is part of their world and part of their practice. There’s research around it that talk about for science and academics, it’s often called the divided life, where their own spirituality or awakening could even really significantly change their life or their course of their work. Katie Turner 00:06:39 And they often it’s rarely discussed publicly because there’s still a lot of stigma and concern about how it’s going to be perceived. And as a mental health professional, I understand that I’m I was trained in psychology first. I did not believe in any of this. I did not, I thought maybe placebo effect. If you if you have this belief that there’s more out there and that helps you, great. The placebo effect is very powerful. But I didn’t think it was much more beyond that. I do believe it is more with the amount of experiences I’ve had with it now. And but our Western model of mental health, if we’re looking at just DSM diagnostic statistical manual alone, there’s not a lot of places to qualify non ordinary states of consciousness. So many people are concerned if they talk about like receiving messages from source or these guidance. It’s they can be worried of are people going to think I’m like quote unquote crazy. And on the other side of it, sometimes spiritual communities, if you do Google spiritual awakening, you often get, I call it almost like the wild West of answers out there. Katie Turner 00:07:43 And it’s really hard for people who are new in that space. I know I made a lot of mistakes in it, trying to find trying to navigate what was going on and find support and mentorship in it. There’s a lot of stuff that’s really. There’s some stuff that’s really helpful, and some people are really helpful, and there’s stuff that’s just misinformed, unintentionally harmful, or even potentially predatory and very harmful. So I wanted to give people more of some guidelines of just to come back to when they’re navigating their own journey of just things to look out for, because also sometimes, you know, a spiritual awakening for some people, it actually could be quite destabilizing and it may overlap, or it may be a sign of a mental health crisis as well. And some more, more intuitive people may may just label everything as an awakening, and people may not get the help they need. If it’s if there’s actually more mental health stuff going on as well. Lisa Lewis 00:08:38 Well, that’s a huge responsibility for, you know, a licensed professional, like walking that fine line. Lisa Lewis 00:08:46 And I guess really knowing really knowing the difference. And I guess how do you use it. Like what How do you use that your practices when you’re working with clients, how do you walk that fine line? Katie Turner 00:08:59 Yeah. So everything as a psychologist, everything I do has to be grounded in evidence based practice and theory. So after I went through my own spiritual awakening, it did take me many years and a very large investment of time, energy, resources to find, training, mentorship, to do other certifications. I did additional training in transpersonal psychology. A lot of work, a lot of approaches that do bring in more, more room for intuition or working with the subconscious, unconscious mind, even the ancestral fields, more, more things that work with that subconscious brain. So you are in more of a metaphoric state, and it’s really it’s not putting it on. It’s part of why I went into private practice was to be able to market in the way to see, do people want this kind of work? Because you always have to meet people where they’re at and what they’re looking for. Katie Turner 00:09:48 But I did find pretty quickly that there were a lot of people who were looking for someone like me because again, a psychologist, anyone, any trained professional needs to have experience in it and enough experience to know enough of what they’re doing. I’m also not an expert in things like bipolar schizophrenia. But you know, I know enough to say to talk with clients about these are some of the symptoms. This is where it overlaps. This is the line we want to walk. And if we’re going into this I am going to recommend that you maybe talk to a psychiatrist or someone who is more specialist here to rule out, as any of this going on, if it’s also very clear that it’s very if someone’s very destabilized, I wouldn’t work with them on this on the awakening part more. so again, it’s I think no one person is an expert on everything, but a lot of the people I work with who it’s it’s more people who are grounded in 3D reality. I do have some free resources that go out with my quiz around, just like really basic screening questions of, is this more of a spiritual Virtual emergency. Katie Turner 00:10:51 And there are some international like free resources that people can go to if they think they might be having one. but a lot of it is significant changes. Are you are you still able to function well in 3D reality? Is there a significant change to your personality? Many healthy people. A spiritual awakening can actually be maybe a bit disorienting and confusing to navigate, and there’s a lot of identity and value shifts. But if people often have the observing ego to witness what’s happening and know who that’s appropriate to talk to or not to say, like, you know, if I got this guidance from a guardian angel, an ancestor, if you’re just going and telling everybody indiscriminately about that, not being able to realize when that makes people uncomfortable or they don’t know what you’re talking about or it’s freaking them out, like that might be more of a sign of something losing touch with that 3D reality piece. Often people, because I get it too, I, I know how crazy it can sound. and so it’s not something I’d ever force on people. Katie Turner 00:11:54 And, and I’m careful like, who I would talk to that about and where and how far to go with it. so I don’t know if that answers some of the questions there. Lisa Lewis 00:12:04 It does. Thank you for explaining all that to me. And, really clarifying the experience. And as a psychotherapist. Part of my training when I was getting, getting my hours for licensure, I wanted to, work in a psychiatric ward. And so I did for a year because I really wanted to know what schizophrenia, bipolar, major depression, what it really looks like. And not that I wanted to work with that population outside in my private practice, but I just really wanted to know when someone comes walking through my door that I may not know exactly how to help them, but I could refer them and I can recognize some symptoms and know what to ask. And so that was, part of my training. And I think that training was really valuable for me. And, I started my own journey with this, working or getting certified in transpersonal energy healing. Lisa Lewis 00:13:09 And then I went to the, the route of like, Western psychology. So, and wanting to marry the both together. And I’m wondering when, when working with clients, or having new clients, do you see HSP, more HSP coming to you? Are these the people that are showing up and having these experiences and wanting to to dive deeper? Katie Turner 00:13:36 Well, my my practice is very specialized for highly sensitive and empathic clients. So I usually do get a lot of that. but I, I have a few areas of specialization. That’s one of them. So I don’t know how that much, how much that contributes to it. I know some of Elaine Aaron’s studies to show that highly sensitive people tend to be more engaged in therapy as well, just because of that motivation to deeply process. They often get a lot out of therapy, and we’re usually pretty motivated to self-reflect. To be aware of our inner world, like therapy is usually a pretty good fit when you find the right approach in person. For many highly sensitive people, I do think intuition and spiritual awakenings are an ability that are are available to everyone, whether they’re highly sensitive or not. Katie Turner 00:14:24 But I do feel some of the highly sensitive traits or even some of the I don’t. I’d be curious to see what more what future research comes out of, almost like the more of the neurodivergent spectrum and high sensitivity as well, because many women with autism have very high empathic, intuitive ability as well. And it’s almost part of the diagnosis, but it’s almost like they’re energy sponges. They’re picking up so much. and people who might identify as an empath. And again, that needs to be there needs to be more study around that. But my experience with it personally is as a dominant intuitive ability, is it’s more of a feeling, sensing other people’s emotions or sensations, physical sensations in your own body as if it is your own. And I was already into this field of psychology before I even had any idea that that was real, or I was doing it. It was an in an intuitive workshop that we had to do different exercises, and then it was just such a light bulb moment of the things I was describing with that guided exercise with people I didn’t know at all, was just so bang on that it really it really started me being curious about how long has this been going on, how much of my own emotions are not actually mine. Katie Turner 00:15:41 And I find for a lot of the clients that I work with theirs that often like that quest for a deeper sense of meaning, purpose, intuitive guidance. and sometimes there are those states of energetic sensitivities that go beyond. It might not be that they’re just processing their own emotions, their own feelings around things they we may be picking up on, more sensitive to the energy of other people environments and or picking up more intuitive information that may be maybe increasing anxiety or other symptoms, that it’s not as easily addressed with just cognitive mind therapy alone, or carrying ancestral stuff, or really young childhood things and more impacted by that. Lisa Lewis 00:16:23 How do you work with clients and what tools do you provide to differentiate between what is mine and what is yours? Katie Turner 00:16:34 Yeah. So I for people who are looking on the empathic part of it, I’m always bringing my full abilities to two therapy as well. I have informed consent Conversations with clients around that to say. Are you comfortable with this? It’s always run through your own intuition, like, does this feel right for you? So it can be more of a do we want to go this way? What are you sensing picking up? This is what I’m getting. Katie Turner 00:17:00 I do a lot of almost similar to hypnosis type work, energy psychology or tapping ancestral field work. Really early childhood and trauma processing work too. So a lot of times it’s more about guiding clients to see where is the energy in your body. More somatic based work. Whose is this? Is it yours or not? Yours. Like we really have to slow down and go go inwards to see what’s the subtleties of these energies. Usually if we’re actually carrying other people’s energy or if it’s taking on other people’s energy, there’s some part of us that’s also like kind of allowing that in or is used to doing that. A lot of it, I find for a lot of empathic people, again, it’s going to be different for everyone. These are just overall themes. So if someone’s like, that doesn’t fit for me. I’m not saying it’s everyone. I just want to make sure I say that as well. Is sometimes, especially for people who are highly sensitive and do have more of the empathic ability we often just take. Katie Turner 00:17:59 We’re often very distressed by people we love when they’re distressed, and we sometimes we want to fix it more than they’re motivated to change. Because we can we can feel it energetically. And as young children and babies, it’s like we’re born with this, this open, this open sensitivity. For some people, childhood trauma or environments may actually make that amplify that. But I’ve heard some therapists say that it’s all trauma based. I don’t personally believe that because I’ve seen many cases and and might even my own, that there isn’t significant trauma history, that this just seems to be a nervous system ability. And I know there’s a lot of debate in the field right now, even around is this all autism is a trauma. Like I think again, I think it’s multiple pathway models, but we’ll need more research to fully tease that out. but anyway, I think sometimes working with the deeper childhood belief systems of yes, you might be feeling this energy, you’re not responsible for fixing it. Really kind of bringing ourselves back into our adult self. Katie Turner 00:19:04 A lot of inner child worker re parenting work, but specific around belief systems for kind of carrying this energy for other people can really help our experience of it in the world, like the empathic ability. For me, I a lot of times I work with people and they’re really struggling with it because when you’re feeling everybody’s stuff, I’m the state of the world around us seems to be getting more and more intense. More and more people aren’t doing great or are struggling. So if we need everybody around us to feel okay, for us to feel okay, we often don’t feel okay. And, and so I, I think the more the more we can kind of work with those parts. It the empathic ability can can get less intense and we can get intuitive information in other pathways. We can also have different energetic boundaries with it that we don’t have to work so hard to keep kind of clearing, protecting, maintaining. But it is a process and it takes time. Empathic ability. For me, I used to I used to hate it. Katie Turner 00:20:03 Like I think if you could pick an intuitive ability, this isn’t one I’d recommend, but it doesn’t really work that way. It’s just like which one is our nervous system wired for? And we got to work with it from there. And now it really is a gift and it really is a blessing. But I’ve had to do a lot of work to get here. Lisa Lewis 00:20:19 Yes, I am just nodding yes to everything that you just said. I mean, I hear you, I resonate with you and I’m so glad that you are doing this work and bringing it out into the world, and also that you’re grounded in the work that you also have. you know, you’re a psychologist, so you have that credential and so people can take you seriously. And also that you’re holding like, you know, both sides and wanting to adhere like integrate more of this. It’s not like a black and white. It’s actually there’s a lot of, crisscrossing over. And I love that. And, like, I feel like I’m trying to do that work, too. Lisa Lewis 00:21:08 I am, just stepping into, like, doing parts work, not ifs or internal family systems, but doing some parts work because I’m feeling that is coming up a lot in myself and with clients and just knowing these different parts. And so like I also see like as a grounded part and also like the spiritual part, and there’s so many different ways we can keep separating those parts. And like you said like really fleshing it out. Katie Turner 00:21:38 I just think it’s where we’re spiritual beings having a human experience. And it’s all of it’s important. But like they. The body, the mind, the nervous system, how trauma is stored in the body, the spirituality piece can really help, but it doesn’t bypass the human part of the human experience. Lisa Lewis 00:21:59 Yes. And that’s another, topic to we could do a whole, podcast episode on spiritual bypassing. Katie Turner 00:22:07 Yeah, that’s very exciting that you’re doing that work. I like I like part’s work. It’s something I draw from as well, because parts have very distinct energies. Katie Turner 00:22:14 Like it can be very helpful to work with them. Lisa Lewis 00:22:17 Yes. Katie, have you experienced your own spiritual awakening, and if so, what was that like for you? Katie Turner 00:22:26 Yeah. Lisa Lewis 00:22:26 So I. Katie Turner 00:22:28 I stumbled onto it without knowing what I was getting into necessarily. I was very burnt out, kind of for the first few years in the field and finishing, graduate school. And I just. I booked a one way ticket to India. I ended up being in India, Nepal for almost nine months, and I was feeling a little bit disillusioned with certain things in the field. A lot of my training initially was very conscious mind focus, a lot of CBT behavior change model, and I’m not knocking those approaches in any way. With psychology, there’s really more. It’s got to be the right fit for the client and where they’re at. There’s lots of research that is helpful, but I found personally that I could analyze a lot of the issues I had, and but it didn’t really transform anything for me. Katie Turner 00:23:16 You could have ways to cope with stuff or old patterns. You could understand, oh, my childhood and even my parents parents. And this is probably why it happened, but I’d still be having it. So I found and and it was some kind of mentorship early in the field to where, like some clients, you’d keep coming back to the same community agencies and working really hard but not making any progress. and I had a mentor who said something around. Well, sometimes therapy just helps people not get worse. And I didn’t sit right with me. And I get that, you know, nobody. Everyone has their own journey. Sometimes it is really long. We can’t sometimes people. That is an important piece of it. But I am really my private practice, and part of why I went into private practice was a lot of our community agencies have kind of strong mandates about what approaches can be used and what type of therapy can be provided. A lot of it’s really short term, like solution focused, CBT focused, and I that deeper work, like the parts work, the energy, the working with trauma processing type things that help move that energy through our nervous system. Katie Turner 00:24:24 There wasn’t a lot of space with any space to do a lot of that work with clients, and that is some of the work that I found has been really profoundly transformational. So I work a lot with clients who have done a level of personal development work. They may even be professional mental health professionals themselves. And they’re there. They know their patterns. They’re very self-aware. They may have done many types of therapy, and they’re stuck. Like, you get to a point where you hit a wall and you’re like, I need something more. I don’t know what it is. I’ve done everything, but this is still this pattern is still here. So that’s where I kind of help people go through that. And my but my awakening, like it started happening there and then in, in India, I kept I kept both parts of my life very separate for a number of years. I was very much in the spiritual closet and I don’t I wouldn’t recommend a professional going through that and is very new in it. Katie Turner 00:25:14 Start working with clients. With that, you need to get grounded in it yourself first, and you need feedback loops like you need to be very clear on what’s your own intuition, how to bring that in in a in a safer ethical way, or how you how you bring that in to guide your work? There’s often additional training and mentorship needed. But, it was because I was doing a lot of meditation and Having a lot of time kind of in that space. It’s that then Maya, then Maya intuitive abilities started to open up more and more, and then I came back. I kept exploring more in the alternative spaces, but keeping it very separate from psychology for a while. But I was having enough experiences in those alternative spaces that it was really shifting my viewpoint, and I talked about it in my book. Two of like one of the really clear guidance pieces for me was I kept I spent about a year wrestling with this question because I had put so much time and energy like the process to become a psychologist is so intensive, and I was so early in it that I hadn’t paid things off like I, but I was really questioning of, do I have to leave the field completely to go take this spiritual path, or do I follow what my colleagues are doing, do the safe thing like work in a hospital system or a health system, like actually start making some money, be able to provide for myself in a more clear, safe way. Katie Turner 00:26:38 And I was washing dishes at the sink and I put down the dish soap. And this bubble just floated up, like, at eye level. And it went down my whole apartment. It turned about five different corners. It stayed the same level. There was no there was no physical reason it should have behaved that way. And I just followed it, mesmerized, and it went into the room I had set up as kind of an energy healing meditation room. It hovered there for a minute, then it popped and I had full body goosebumps and just this full knowing of like, I don’t know. I was like, I can’t ask this question anymore. I will not get a more clear answer than this. It didn’t. I didn’t know how that was going to look. It still took many years to figure out what are the trainings, how to actually bring this in as a psychologist, is it even going to work? Well? Will people want this or will I do this, open this business, have it fail and be back in agencies again? So there was still so much unknown in that. Katie Turner 00:27:32 But I was like, I know the foundation needs to be the spirituality like it cannot be hidden in here. It cannot be psychology only like there’s something very profound. And I was seeing enough results with people through energy, work and other things that some stuff I’d see clear really quickly. And we weren’t taught in psychology that that was even possible. And again, it’s case by case, I don’t think I wouldn’t trust anyone who’s like, oh, I can miracle cure anyone. It’s you really. Depending on what layer you’re getting to and how much work it’s going to take to clear that layer for each person. But, you know, that’s where I started seeing almost like past life things I didn’t really know or believe in that at the time. now I think there’s something to it because I’d have clients this this is separately. I do more energy work, not as a psychologist or like just in my personal life, to see just to develop that skill for myself. Almost like a personal, personal interest thing. Katie Turner 00:28:29 and people would tell me what they were seeing and I would have seen the same thing. And then they report back to me and symptoms will go away. Like I’d have people saying like, panic attacks went away. Other stuff went away. And just like that one clearing and psychology doesn’t. I didn’t have any way to make sense of that fully as a psychologist. So then I kind of went more down the rabbit hole of the quantum physics research findings being like, how how is this possible? And there’s a really good book called The Awakened Brain that it is also, I forget if she’s a psychiatrist or a neuroscientist, but she’s out of the stage and she does a really good job of talking, explaining the neurobiological research of that. Our brains actually seem to be designed to communicate with this larger field and receive information from it back. Lisa Lewis 00:29:14 Wow, that sounds really exciting. I have to pick that book up and read it. Yeah. It’s really. So how do you work with clients now with, you’ve you’ve gone through a lot. Lisa Lewis 00:29:25 And so how do you work with clients now? Katie Turner 00:29:29 Yeah. Well, I mean a lot. It’s again, it depends on each person. I have a lot of different tools to draw from. There’s no one thing that works best for each person. so I have my practice, but I can only work with people who are in Alberta. Or there’s a few eastern provinces that have kind of allowed for virtual therapy if anyone’s registered in Canada. But psychology is pretty regulated by location. So my I have been getting intuitive calling over the last few years, really to to offer more beyond just therapy, because I do feel like more and more people need this kind of information. And there’s not there’s not that many professionals publicly talking about it. I do think that it’s changing. I, I think there’s many professionals who are open to it, even if they don’t know what to do with it themselves. Like, I know a lot of therapists who are they’d be open if a client talked to them about it, wouldn’t necessarily think there’s something mental health going on, but they wouldn’t necessarily know how to work with it with them. Katie Turner 00:30:29 Because I think when you’re getting into the energetic domain, you need someone who knows how to navigate the energetic domain too. It’s not rational thoughts anymore. Lisa Lewis 00:30:38 hum, hum. What advice would you give someone just beginning their spiritual journey, especially as an HSP? Katie Turner 00:30:47 Yeah, I’d say that if you want to open up intuition more, it’s about having that space so that that knowing can just come in. So whether that’s meditation, it’s time out of that is time in nature. But you really have to have time where you’re getting out of the rational mind and the overthinking loop and trying to figure everything out so that that knowing can come in. Keeping a journal and documenting any synchronicities, signs, things that maybe could be intuition, but you’re not sure that can help you pay more attention to it. It can help it open up more. Doctor Judith Orloff and many other intuitive recommend meditation. Again, I think meditation or just that quiet mind. Peace is a big one. And also learning what way your dominant ability is. Katie Turner 00:31:32 That’s kind of why I created the self-test. It’s it’s not research validated. It’s just kind of for fun and personal reflection of if, you know, this is the way I most like, easily receive intuitive information, you can then meditate and pay attention to that sensation, like that sense, whether that’s a knowing or visual impression. Is there any kind of auditory messages? You can be open to those messages coming through and pay more attention to that one sense or two senses. We usually have 1 or 2 dominant ones, and the more we pay attention to those, the more the rest will continue to open. I used to think of an intuitive ability as like a Christmas present that it’s like, find your gifts. And I wanted to know what my quote unquote gift was like. Open it up, play with it, have it. It’s for for so many people. I don’t see it play out like that. It’s actually more of a journey and unfolding, and it keeps evolving and changing as we as we evolve and change. Katie Turner 00:32:25 So how it came through to me before is very is different than it is now. and it keeps changing and shifting. I also would recommend people do like some type of screening or have a sense of, is this stable for me to do? Because I don’t want to advise everyone to go do this. People with a if they have a mental health history of psychosis, if there is risk for that, if there’s serious, unprocessed childhood trauma, a spiritual awakening itself can be traumatic as well. So it’s not safe for everyone to actually proceed with that. It can be very destabilizing. That’s going to be a smaller percent of the population, but it’s still a percent. So I don’t know what the exact percentage would be. But I think, again, it’s like proceeding with safety and discernment and integrity, like I want people to be safe in this journey. And because I think that spirituality piece should help us function as a human, not derail us from functioning in the in the 3D reality that spiritual being in a human experience still. Lisa Lewis 00:33:25 Yeah, very well said. Thank you. And that importance of keeping everybody safe because that’s the most important thing overall. Katie, what would you like listeners to take away from our conversation today? If you have like one message, what would that be? Katie Turner 00:33:43 Yeah, I think that it is that that that part of us is real. I think it is an inherent kind of human birthright ability. We’ve lost touch with it in our society and culture. But I do think it’s coming back. And there’s so much I think there’s so much benefit in it because it’s just I’ll talk about it as like our personal GPS or compass of usually we want our own strong knowing of what to do and really emotionally charged situations. We need to practice and open up that ability outside of those situations for it to be at all helpful or accessible in really emotional decisions. So it’s like start playing with it, having fun with it, use low stakes stuff. but it will open up more over time and it can just help. Katie Turner 00:34:31 I mean, I’m way less anxious. Being connected with it doesn’t mean the anxiety is totally gone, but it’s completely shifted from where I was before I had this connection and sense of trust. Lisa Lewis 00:34:41 Yes. That, anxiety is, I’m just not in my head as you’re as you’re, saying your message and as an HSP myself. And it’s like, well, like, yes, sometimes it is overwhelming to to have this, this anxiety. And also it’s there for a reason. And just being okay with that and accepting that I guess more that we can accept it, that we can have a better relationship with it, and then we can feel better overall as we go through our, our life and our journey. Katie Turner 00:35:15 Yeah. And often that, that spiritual connection like it’s our direct contact to like a soul level part of us. So it often really is our pathway to deeper meaning purpose like more returning to peace. More like being able to come back to a place where it feels like everything’s okay, even when it doesn’t feel like everything’s okay in the world and not in a bypassing way, but in a like, how do you actually kind of put on your own oxygen mask first and do the work you’re here to do in the world? Lisa Lewis 00:35:44 Yes, in a healthy way. Lisa Lewis 00:35:48 So how can listeners find you. Katie Turner 00:35:51 Yeah. My website is probably the best place. Katie Turner psychology. Com or I’m on social media as well. Lisa Lewis 00:35:58 Okay. And do you have a free gift for my listeners. Katie Turner 00:36:03 Yeah. Well I have a like as part of creating the book, I did create a free quiz there and a free, there’s a six week like Deepen Your Intuition challenge once people take the quiz to find out their dominant ability. So it comes with some journal templates, reflection exercises. People can check that out. that challenge won’t be there forever. I don’t have a set end time with it at this time, but but yeah, there’s some good freebies there. I put a lot of work into them. Lisa Lewis 00:36:29 Yeah, it sure sounds like it. Thank you so much for offering that. And thank you so much for your time and sharing your personal experience and just how you work with clients and ISPs, and giving us more information about what’s happening in the psychology world around iPads and, you know, psychology and the more spiritual practices and integrating those. Lisa Lewis 00:36:58 And, I just really want to thank you for that, for doing this, this work. And really, I guess you’re changing the field of psychology. Katie Turner 00:37:07 Well, I don’t think, like, I definitely can’t take credit for it. I think I’m one person in it. But there’s definitely I have to give a lot of credit to the teachers and mentors who’ve come before and who have paved the way for this to be possible. Lisa Lewis 00:37:20 Yeah, yes. Of course. And then you’re you’re they’ve handed the baton to you and you’ve taken it and you’re doing what you’re it sounds like being asked to do so. Appreciate that. Katie Turner 00:37:30 Thank you so much. And thank you for the work you’re doing. Lisa Lewis 00:37:33 You’re welcome. Thank you for joining me and my guest, Katie Turner, for this powerful conversation about navigating spiritual awakenings as highly sensitive people. Katie’s insights into integrating psychology and spirituality offer a beacon of hope for those on the spiritual path. Be sure to check out her book F Toxic Spirituality, and explore her other resources for spiritual growth. Lisa Lewis 00:38:02 As we wrap up this episode. I have a heartfelt announcement. After three years of producing the Sensitive and Nature podcast, it’s time for me to take a pause. This hiatus marks the end of an incredible journey of supporting highly sensitive people and fostering meaningful conversations. While the podcast may be on pause. I’m not stepping away from my mission. I’ll be looking to guest on other podcasts to continue spreading awareness and support for highly sensitive persons. If you know of a podcast where my message would resonate, I love to connect. Thank you for your support over the years. Stay connected and remember that sensitivity is a strength, a gift, and a path to profound transformation. Until next time, or whenever that may be. Take care, stay sensitive, and stay in tune with nature. Bye for now. Thank you for joining me on this episode of Sensitive in Nature. I hope you found inspiration and solace in our exploration of the profound connection between highly sensitive people and the natural world. If you enjoy today’s episode, please consider subscribing, leaving a review, or sharing it with someone who might find comfort and insight into our discussions. Lisa Lewis 00:39:31 Your support means the world to me. Remember, you can always connect with me on social media or visit my website. Sensitive in nature. Com for additional resources and updates. Let’s continue this conversation and build a community where sensitivity is celebrated and nature is cherished as the ultimate healer. Until next time, take a moment to breathe. Embrace the beauty around you and know that you are not alone in this journey. May nature always be your sanctuary. This podcast is designed to provide accurate and authoritative information in regards to this subject matter covered. It is given with the understanding that neither the host, the publisher or the guest are rendering legal, accounting, clinical or any other professional information. If you want a professional, you should find one.